Funny, I always hear from IBOs how awesome the teaching system is and I ask them to kindly explain 1 or 2 things that upline taught (at a function or on tape)that will help them to run a profitable quixtar business.

I am still waiting..........

Matt, you are very unfortunate to have gone through that experience. I am a new IBO myself. my upline is very dedicated to me and helping me grow my business the best they can. They are professional businessmen and do not pressure me into anything. If I choose not to do something, they dont want me to do it...honestly. Being an IBO is a very respectable title to have. You just have to be willing to listen, learn and apply. Why get started with the business if your not willing to work? The statement you made about 1,000 people until diamond...is not true. It is all about how you and your upline structure your business. Its not all about getting as many people on your downline as possible, its about investing a majority of your time to 1 or 2 people in your downline at a time and produce a business relationship, but more importantly, a personal relationship that will benefit your future. This is a wonderful business, if you dont produce hard work, you will make little money, loose money, or break even. If you work hard at your business you can make as much money as you wish. People who have negative comments about IBO's are usually the ones that are not willing to work. If this business was not sucessfull, my upline would not be making over $60,000 / yr when he has only been in business for just under 3 years. The numbers are real...you just have to want them!

Good luck Neal.

By the way, how do you know what your upline makes? Have you seen his/her profit/loss statements?

Hi everyone im not too sure about the Quixtar but I just went to one of the meetings tonight and I thought it was very intersting and I gave it some thoughts and im going to give it a try... I found this blog by tring to further my intrest in IBO and how well it can be a asset to me ....

Craig, please read more articles on this blog. For most people who "try" quixtar, you will end up losing time and money. Ironically, time and money is probably what someone said you could get more of byy joining quixtar.

Matt said " The entire time I was in 'the business' I just couldn't ignore the numbers. It took 1,000 people or so to 'make' a diamond. When they'd ask at a function "why aren't you all diamonds?" I thought the guy was completely stupid and wanted to shout "only 1 in 1,000 of us could be!"

Joe says "That's about right and until you look at the business from a logical perspective, you can be tricked into chasing the dream also!"

Shaun said: I'm not sure what you people are talking about, but quixtar is the best thing that has ever happened to me. With-in the next two years I will be a DIAMOND!!!! So stop with your negitive mind set and get up and do somthing.
Posted by: Shaun on March 23, 2004 01:14 PM

Joe says: What happened to Shaun? Has there been any new diamonds named "Shaun" lately?

Diamond said: Being an IBO is the best thing that ever happened to me and frankly I say to you 50 yr plan for u 5 yr plan for me in financial freedom yay I win!!

Joe says: I take it you just signed up for quixtar. Did you know the corporation is changing the name back to "Amway"?

Diamond said: what does that matter if they change their name to poop im still growing and making money

Joe says: Care to give some details on your business or are you playing the fale it till you make it routine?

What I want to know is why those who have made it, uplines are they called?? Why none of THEM ever post anything? They are the ones who know the real deal. I have yet to hear of someone who has made thousands of dollars off of this, I have only come across hear say. I want to hear first hand.

Terrence, there are some former diamonds who have come forward with their stories. These diamonds have said they made most of their money from the sale of tapes, books and seminar tickets and not from quixtar.

I believe that to be true and I believe many downline are deceived into thinking that they will get rich from quixtar.

I don’t know why are you giving your negative comments..have you really seen the real deal? What you are saying is probably the words of others who couldn’t do it.. when I first joined Quixtar, the first thing my upline told me was , “ its totally up to you how you handle this business..i have seen people who have covered the cost of registration in a month, I have seen who covered it in 6 months and I have seen who are in this business for more than a year and they are still unable to recover their cost ”
So you see the deal here..its not about selling..its about sharing the opportunity and creating a network..we all use and buy products..why not buy one of the best products ( you can do a research on these products).. why not buy these and let others know about it..my upline never told me that I ll be able to reach the diamond level..he told me “ if you want to get good stuff and get paid for it and want extra $500-$1000 at the end of the month, you are welcome ” ( and yes I got $8 first month..$100 the second month..this is my third month and I ll be getting $200 +) so yea this thing is real !!
One more thing I would like to add, we all do shopping right? U burn your fuel to get to the store and buy household products..if you see the trend, fuel cost will go high in no time in next few years..and according to many believers, the next generation shopping will be done on the internet.. and the is the best place I could find to do the online shopping.. except for making negative comments you can ask anyone who is in this thing.. and m not asking anyone of you to join, I am just sharing what we have real !!
Any questions you want to ask, feel free to ask me razazaidi@gmail.com

kp said: So you see the deal here..its not about selling..its about sharing the opportunity and creating a network..

Joe says: That approach to this business makes it possibly an illegal pyramid.

kp said: ( and yes I got $8 first month..$100 the second month..this is my third month and I ll be getting $200 +) so yea this thing is real !!

Joe says: Great, how many people did you sponsor and how much are you spending on standing order and functions?

Buying double x for $78 instead of a multi vitamin for $15.99 at Costco doesn;t seem like a good value to me.

yup..good questions joe..m glad..
illegal pyramid? which means person at the top makes most of the money right?now i dont know if you are going to believe me, but my sponcer made more money in a particular month than his upline.(yes i saw the cheques).and you can also check websites ( non quixtar) which quote quixtar to be one of the most successful "LEGAL" business in US..Furthermore stores like dell, circut city and barns and nobles are partnered with us..dont u think they have lawers to tell them this thing is illegal?

i sponcored 3 people, who then sponcored few more..and i am not on standing order, my upline is providing the cds and books..but i am going to buy those eventually..and i went to one function "FED"..it cost me around $200 for the trip..well i dont see any waste here..it was worth it i know..it was an invesment made for myself..

and about dounlex well its not $78 its $52 for the ibos...and i cant explain this, you are a smart guy no doubt about that..do a little bit of research if u can abt these.you will find the answer...i use them and i love them !!
its a v good value for me..and i get paid for eating those. !!

kp said: i sponcored 3 people, who then sponcored few more..and i am not on standing order, my upline is providing the cds and books..but i am going to buy those eventually..and i went to one function "FED"..it cost me around $200 for the trip..well i dont see any waste here..it was worth it i know..it was an invesment made for myself..

Joe says: So basically, your group is losing money - due to the functions, and eventually you will lose even more when you start buying your own tapes. If you enjoyed the function, that's great but what benefit was it to your business?

kp said: and about dounlex well its not $78 its $52 for the ibos

Joe says: Excuse me, I thought you sold those to customers once in a while. Even at $52, it's more than double the cost of multi vitamins that I can get at Costco. Oh, and Costco gives me a 3 month supply for less than half the price of a 30 day supply of double x.

Yea, I would have quit talking to Joe too. It's what you make it! Spend little time, make little money. Spend a lot of time, make a lot of money! It isn't for everyone. Some people would rather sit at home and watch a movie instead of showing someone the plan. The plan is now available on line. Go find it! Then talk to an IBO.

Hey David, do you have an update on your quixtar efforts?

I was a former "IBO" for quixtar, or i mean distributor instead of buisiness owner. I can tell you being out of the business I see what is truly important to me in life, more so than material things they say you can have if you become a diamond, ect in supporting your business. Im a manager at a grocery store and I can tell you I have a couple thousand dollars sitting in my bank account and I have alot more time on my hands. Some of the best things in life are free! I know have more TIME and MONEY, than I ever did with being an IBO! Life is great, its all what you make out of it!

I saw whole conversation and by the grace of god I have attended many of suchkind of meetings. Quixtar give it as name of E-Commerce but it is simplpy MLM(Multy Level Marketing). Many of the post authors are rightly saying that why only one in Diamond category instead of all of them... Dude its all about making others convience and making ur downline work for you so u get money widout working. This is kinda Immoral. Circuit City and others earn money from this so for them nothing is illegal...

CP, you are right. Other businesses like Walmart may have critics, but those critics don't call Walmart a scam like critics of the quixtar tools kingpins.

I've been contacted twice to join one of these joints and I had 2 friends who joined them. I thought about becoming a member also. So here are some of my thoughts:
Currently, I like my way of living and having a ton of money doesn't buy you happiness, nor does it buy you time. In their "events" they tell you that everyone can become a multi-millionaire just by joining and working hard. It has yet to be explained what hard work means.
What do I actually have to do to make it work?

Any other job has a clear description: build 3 houses instead of 2 in the same amount of time. Get your website done in 2 weeks instead of 6 months... you get my point.
To accomplish that you need the right tools with the right people that actually do the work. In these events you only talk to the people that don't do the work. They want you to work... to which they don't have a description for. Visiting all your friends is not work... it's socializing and, depending on your friends, can become embarrassing. Has nothing to do with work.

In case you're a talented guy that can convince even strangers to buy anything, you might be better off working in sales for a big company. Those bonuses are great - I've never heard of a successful salesman complaining about playing golf with partners. And if you're good in selling, you probably have no problem selling yourself in interviews either.

I congratulate everyone who actually made it. However, I also feel sorry for those that have to lie about how much they made to cover up their "hopefully" once-in-a-lifetime mistake.

I spent some time writing this hoping that I might have saved someones time and money by trying. Get a real job or come up with your own business idea!

Currently, I like my way of living and having a ton of money doesn't buy you happiness...

Don't worry, unless you're one of the few upper-levels who make money an entirely different way (off teaching materials and events) you won't get the chance to let a ton of money change your character. But you can spend a lot of cash and time learning what not to do! :-)

What do I actually have to do to make it work?

You have to be one of the founders, or one of the "Diamonds" who makes money as described above. Of course, even then, it depends upon what "works" mean. If "working" means making money without scamming others, then it never "works."

In these events you only talk to the people that don't do the work. They want you to work...

Well, half right. They're generally "working" too. Only none of that "work" actually produces any economic value. But you're right in thinking that they're trying to recruit you so that they can stop working so hard at it.

The reason why some people in Quixtar can get "residual income" AKA getting something for nothing, is they need ot get enough mislead downline to do the work for them. Thus the downline gets nothing for something while the upline kingpin gets something for nothing.

Even wonder why many diamonds talk about early retirement yet they are still working?

Me: So I challenge you now to give me a respectable and provable reason as why not to get into this.

Joecool says: I suspect you are not sincere about this, but I will give it a shot:

1. The average income of an active IBO is $115 a month before expenses. Amway discarded the IBOs who do nothing from their count.

2. Many IBOs shoot for platinum. A fraction of 1% of IBOs reach platinum. Platinum does not guarantee you a net profit if you are dedicated to a teaching system. Only a fraction of 1% of platinums ever go onto diamond.

3. The pyramidal nature of the compensation plan ensures that most IBOs make little or nothing so a few can succeed.

4. The prices of products are not competitive. Amway builds in at least a 30%+ margin to cover the cost of IBO bonuses.

5. The company has a shady reputation because of trick or deceptive IBOs who use questionable recruitment tactics.

6. Buying from Amway is actually not good for your local economy. Profit goes to Amway and your neighborhood store loses a sale.

I hope I addressed your concern. U have more if you request.

p.s. Happy New Year!

Me- I think the point is that the average person doing Amway gets a very very low return on their time investment, even much lower than from a minimum wage job.

The only way that a person can "succeed" is to convince a large number of people below them to work for, on average, far less than minimum wage by drastically misrepresenting how much they can expect to earn per hour worked.

Many companies and organizations have a pyramid shaped organizational chart. The difference is that in a job or company, all employees get paid and have a net gain at the end of the month. Also, the money is made from customers. In Quixtar, many of the lower tiered IBOs make nothing and possibly suffer losses if they are in the tools system.

Yes, there are some teams who operate ethically, but many do not. How would someone know whether they are in a good group or not? WHy doesn't the corporation seek and shut down the bad teams?

I joined Amway/Quixtar in January 2009, when I was 24 years old. I thought everything about my business "team" was shady (and still think it's shady) but I'm still a member.

Here's my story...

I graduated from college in 2006 and went on to pursue a higher degree. In graduate school I was living off of student loans and a graduate assistant stipend. Toward the end of my three-year graduate program in October 2008, a girl from college called me out of the blue and left a message saying she wanted to "catch up".

I was excited to hear from her so I called her back. We did a bit of awkward small talk before she asked me if I was ready to make a little extra income on the side. Of course I was game but I wanted more details.

She proceeded to hide the ball from me for the next few weeks only letting me know that her business partnered with stores like Circuit City, Nike, Adidas, etc. Then she directed me to her personal information website "[Last Name] Business Group". The site gave me absolutely no details...only vague notions of financial freedom.

The girl told me she knew someone who could answer her questions and she passed on my information to "a woman in her business group" to give me details. I had another awkward conversation with this chick and only got vague answers. Over the next few months I ignored her voice messages until it was time for my school's Christmas break.

In late December I finally answered the phone when the upline member called and agreed to meet her. I met with her in January 2009 at a Panera (where I soon found out my whole business team always met at). She gave me details about the business, finally mentioned Quixtar and then showed me some of her old business checks. Since I sell on eBay quite a bit, I was super excited and wondered why they didn't tell me about this from the start.

I agreed to sign up and did so with the upline, her husband and the girl I knew from college at a local Panera. When I joined I was told that I was joining a business where I could set my own hours and work as little or as much as I wanted.

During January 2009 I followed instructions like a lemming. I went to a few open meetings (paid $5-10 per meeting), I ordered products, I joined LTD (Leadership Team Development) and went to an LTD-sponsored function which cost me close to $200 for a weekend of learning about how to grow my business.

I immediately thought LTD was a bit cultish and started asking a ton of questions: Why do we have to pay for meetings each week? Who's in charge? How much do the speakers get paid?

No one could answer my questions.
And most importantly, they weren't teaching me the business skills I craved: How to sell products. They were only focused on recruitment, aka getting more people involved. Plus, the personal recruitment website they offered cost close to $20/month.

By February 2009, I started calling my friends and Facebook friends(at the instruction of my upline) and had my own GRAND OPENING, which is where I invited my family and friends to try out products.

Calling my friends was embarrassing...and hardly anyone reacted positively. Still I was urged to do supervised calls in front of my upline, where they encouraged me not to give out the Quixtar/Amway website, so I didn't. People I called were confused...and if they were excited initially, within a week they had decided not to join. Also, I found it odd that my upline was willing to drive to my college campus which was an hour away from where they lived, just to supervise my recruitment phone calls. They also had me give them a list of phone numbers for my friends and such so they could call people I knew (bad idea).

I started getting texts & Facebook messages & emails from old classmates saying "I think someone hacked into your Facebook account" or "A guy named Brian says he's your friend and he's pretending to know you." SO EMBARASSING!

At my February 2009 GRAND OPENING, 3 ladies from my team showed up to help show products aka they took over, and about 12 friends/family showed up to participate. I advertised the GRAND OPENING as a purse & makeup party and no mention of Amway/Quixtar was made. I was hoping to sell the name-branded stuff advertised in the catalog at the time...such as Dooney & Bourke purses, Ugg boots, Levis Jeans.

My team brought a car full of Amway/Quixtar core brand products (Nutrilite, Artisty, etc.) to my house, mostly core products like vitamins, nutrition products, Artistry makeup and cleaning products. NOTHING NAME BRAND. My upline seemed a bit frustrated that I had also provided sandwiches and snacks for people to try. They only wanted people to be eating the Amway brand snack bars.

The party went fine, and people seemed to enjoy the demonstrations...but my upline did all the talking. I just stood around like a lame duck.

At the end of the party, they convinced some folks to buy a few things. I spent around $115 buying samples, food, goodie bag supplies filed with samples, business cards, etc. After everyone left, my main upline asked me to meet her at Panera in an hour. I did and there she told me that I'd really did well and that I could qualify for a bonus if I bought my monthly supply of point value. Filled with excitement I bought about $100 worth of products. My total profit from that month: $82. Total spent: $215.

Being a smart, independent thinker, by mid-February 2009, I was questioning why I joined. My upline kept urging me to go to LTD weekly meetings, where everyone drank XS Energy Drinks and I felt like I was trapped in the movie, "Disturbing Behavoir" with Katie Holmes. The meetings were repetitive and I was sick of paying entry fees. I was also racking up credit card bills paying for Amway products I didn't need to maintain the 50/150 point balance they encouraged.

I didn't want to go Diamond, I just wanted some extra cash and I didn't see how buying stuff from Amway every month would help me. I wanted so despeartely for somehow to show me how to really SELL PRODUCTS.

In March 2009, I had stopped going to meetings as much until one weekend, my upline called me to tell me about a special meeting where I could meet some local Diamonds and that I was invited to an exclusive trip to their house. I was excited to meet the people who were at the top so I went to the meeting which started at 8 pm. My upline said it'd be over by 10:30 pm.

It took me an hour to drive to the meeting, and I was coming from work, so I didn't make it to the meeting until closer to 9. When I got to the hotel meeting room, there were about 700 people present and they were playing a huge game of XS Energy Drink Chug. A REAL drinking contest of chugging XS Energy Drinks. XS Drinks are their core energy drink product which is full of some extravagant amount B12 & B6 Vitamins. I was sooo mad that I had rushed to get there, and even though I was late, they hadn't even started. I found my team members and sat in a section with them.

LTD finally got the business part of the meeting started closer to 10 pm. I sat through hours of hearing testimonials of how the business changed people's lives and how to get more people involved. There were flashy videos of vacation trips to Peter Island & Hawaii, fancy cars, etc...but no mention of how to sell anything.

By 1 a.m. the hotel staff came in and told us (all 700 of us) we had to leave. They had to prepare the room for another event. I was steaming. It was late, I was tired and I had learned nothing about selling products. Plus, I had said I would go to the Diamond's house, which turned out to be half an hour away from our meeting hotel. I decided since it was so late, I might as well go.

I drove to the house. Immediately it felt like the movie "Disturbing Behavoir". The house was huge but in the middle of nowhere. The Diamonds weren't as friendly as I had hoped, either, and didn't seem very excited to see me or the other 20 people who were exclusively invited to their house. They were a lot less smiley off stage.

They gave us a tour of their house including the basement. The basement looked more like a fancy office...lined with awards from LTD & Amway, and photos of when they were awarded Diamond. LTD/Amway/Quixtar was their life. 24/7 they spoke, ate and breathed the business. It was SOOOO CREEPY.

AFter about 20 minutes, I couldn't take it anymore and said I had to leave. After all it was after 2 a.m. and I had to drive over an hour to get home. They told me they were about to have a business meeting. What?!? I insisted I couldn't stay and bolted.

Needless to say, that was pretty much my last LTD Event/Meeting/Gathering. The worst part of it all was that I ended up getting a FLAT on the way home and had to call for help. I was in the middle of nowhere, my cell phone battery was nearly dead and I had to call roadside assistance. They couldn't locate me they transferred me to the Police Dept...who couldn't locate me so they told me to call 911...who couldn't locate me so I waited 35 minutes before a police car happened to be passing by. I was freaking out the whole time, especially since my cell battery was dying. That was the OMEN I needed to stop doing LTD events.

To make a super long story short, I stopped participating in LTD events all together and cancelled my LTD membership, which was separate from Amway.

By April 2010, my team was angry. My upline stopped calling as much and my number was passed to a team member who left me a message saying that "If I wasn't willing to help myself, he was still willing to help me." I was super pissed and told him LTD was a load & that I didn't agree with their super -Republican, pro-gun, anti-gay proproganda. The calls didn't stop. I finally had to ignore them all together and they would still call!

Even stranger, they kept my list of Facebook friends numbers and called one of my former classmates in July 2009 saying that they were a friend of mine and that I recommended her to join. Somehow my friend, just as I had been, was convinced and signed up. They assured her that she didn't need to check out anything with me and urged her not to speak with me at all about the business. They went ahead and registered her under me...and put me down as her "sponsors".

Those idiots forgot that when you "sponsor" someone on Amway, you get an email confirming the sponsorship. So of course I got an email and called me friend wondering how she was able to sign up under me. She explained and I told her that it was all false, but that she was free to stay under me. It wasn't going to hurt me for her to sell point value under me, but it still angered me that my team did this behind my back and actually told her not to talk with me.

Happy ending to this story is that me and this girl are better friends now. Even though she participates in LTD events to a certain extent, she's not brainwashed. We meet up every other month for lunch or dinner, and seldom talk about Amway/Quixtar/LTD unless we like a vitamin or we're complaining about how stupid some of the people are in it or we're talking about clearance items I've sold on eBay. We're able to have a separate life from the crazy business-recruitment focus of LTD. And, til this day, they don't know that we speak or meet up...and honestly if they did, they would probably forbid my friend from doing so.

Meanwhile, I also figured out a way to sell clearance name-brand items from the Amway site ON MY OWN...without LTD's help. For a period of three months Amway was selling clearance-priced UGGs for up to 50% off! I would buy six pairs at a time for around $60, then resell them on eBay for close to $120. I didn't care about the point system, or becoming a diamond. I was finally just getting the profit I craved. They were also selling Reebook, Nike and Adidas shoes, sweatshirts, etc. at up to 80% off the ticket price.

My sister and I bought to pairs of UGGS for under $100 and her friends wanted to know how she got them so cheap so then I had people asking me about how to get cheap UGGs. It was all gravy until Amway ran out of UGG stock.

Regardless, in five months, from August 2009 to December 2009, I made about $1,600 re-selling name-brand clearance stuff I bought on Amway on eBay. According to Amway's 1099 Tax Form, in 2009 (Jan to Dec.), I only made about $600 total in Amway bonuses & profit margins while I spent about $900 trying to keep up with weekly meetings, conferences, gas/travel expenses and buying my 50/150 personal products.

You're probably thinking I quit Amway, but I didn't. Because of the clearance stuff, I decided to re-join Amway/Quixtar in 2010 with the goal of selling clearance name-brand items on eBay & Amazon for profit and completely ignoring LTD's supplement money-eating programs.

I paid $50 to renew my Amway business membership for the 2010 year. I've only spent $80 this year on personal products I actually like from Amway (some of the vitamins, lip gloss and flavored water mixers). So far, I've made about $2,000 on eBay & Amazon selling Amway products. It's tricky because the name brand stuff is not always available on Amway and I have to double check items, but I've done really well with clearance fitness equipment, celebrity perfumes and knives/housewares.

Overall, if you're looking to profit from Amway, the only way you can do so is if you look at it like a wholesale provider or a "Cost-Co". Otherwise, I think you're wasting your time & money...or in my case, Visa & Mastercard's money. Especially since Amway keeps changing rules. In the last year they've increased shipping costs, increased bonus volume requirements and taken away qualifying free shipping for member orders.

I have nothing against Amway per se. They're a legit business and they have some decent products. LTD, on the other hand, is very shady. The things speakers say at conferences are completely whacko. The fees they charge are insane (I spent close to $200 for a weekend conference at a hotel...food & hotel overnight stay not included).

Besides meetings and conferences, LTD also has things like CommuinKate ( a voicemail, email team communication system), CEP (weekly CDs featuring speakers & books), LTD Gear...and also something called "Live the Dream" which is run by a former Abercombie Designer & his Wife (http://www.golivethedream.com/)...they have some really cool clothing designs, but they also ran a line of clothing that said things like "Fight Socialism"...available in Baby sizes too!

Everything I learned about selling Amway products, I taught myself. LTD is not worth the time or money...but most importantly the time. My upline spends 7 days a week going to LTD events & hosting recruitment sessions using LTD methods. They travel hours and hours away from home on weekday nights just to make phone calls or meet up with potential members.

For example, on Valentine's day, one of my upline's husbands flew out of state to meet with potential Amway/Quixtar business sellers and her wife said it was worth it to not spend time now together so that they could spend time together when they go Diamond.

Bottom line: Find out if this experience is worth it for you. If you have $200/month to spend on LTD-sponsored services & you want your entire social life to be about speaking positively about a business that seldom delivers what's promised, join LTD. If you want to make a little extra money, join Amway and sell their name-brand clearance items by Cuisinart, Adidas, Britney Spears Curious perfume, etc. If you don't care to dabble in either, don't sign up. Period.